Discussion:
Credit Iran, not the surge
(too old to reply)
Kurt Nicklas
2008-08-18 11:16:04 UTC
Permalink
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
morgan mair fheal
2008-08-18 11:36:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
a what was the purpose of the surge?

b has that purpose been acheived?

arf meow arf - raggedy ann and andy for president and vice
limp and spineless lint for brains is better yet and nice
then rueing pair of shrub and dick the republican lice
call me desdenova seven seven seven seven seven seven
Scott Erb
2008-08-18 11:50:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From: http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/


American officials have been stun by the demands from the Iraqi
government of Nouri al-Maliki to have a timetable for withdrawal of
American forces from Iraq, and his refusal to go along with a long
term American presence. The working assumption by the US was that the
Iraqi government would need and want American support, even if they
couldn’t appear too eager. Not only would this assure the Iraqi
government could have a strong force to counter resistance, but
American money would continue to flow into Iraq, helping enrich a lot
of people with close ties to the government.

However, the US is not popular amongst the Iraqi people, and often
tries to overtly impact Iraqi politics. Maliki himself is in power
because the US did not want al-Jaafari, his predecessor, to keep that
role, even though he was chosen by the victors in Iraq’s elections.
For months there was a lack of a clear government as the Iraqis and
the US tussled over the issue, with Maliki finally chosen as a
compromise. Think of the message this sends Maliki: if you want to
stay Prime Minister, you shouldn’t do things that make it difficult
for us to pursue our goals in Iraq. Maliki could take this two ways —
either to say, “gee, America has the power and can use it, I’ll watch
myself,” or “as long as the US is here, I’m vulnerable.”

Apparently he’s taken the latter approach, and is presenting himself
as an anti-occupation nationalist who is willing to tell the Americans
to go home, and even be seen as embracing Barack Obama’s Iraq plan.
American officials seem to think he may be overestimating his power,
but recognize that within the Iraqi government he has created a pretty
strong power base. He won’t be as easy to remove as Jaafari was, if
the Americans were to try. Moreover, strategically the US is no longer
in a position to make such demands. One of the key reasons may be
Iran.

A lot of people credited the “surge” with making life in Iraq better
in 2007. Yet the primary reason things got better were: a) the US
stopped fighting the Sunni insurgents and instead made peace with them
to narrow the focus to al qaeda; and b) Moqtada al Sadr refused to
directly confront the US and Iraqi forces, and instead appeared to
acquiesce to Maliki in Basra. The only thing can explain “b” is that
Iran is the puppetmaster here. al-Sadr has spent a lot of time in
Iran, and the Iranians probably are his insurance against being
eliminated as a political force.

Consider the following scenario. It’s well known that Iraqi Shi’ites
and the government have not been overly happy with US policy towards
the Sunni tribes. They have not disarmed them, and in some cases have
given them arms and aid in order to ‘fight al qaeda.’ Al qaeda,
however, is not a strong force in Iraq. It came after the US invasion,
has always been rather small, and overly brutal. The Sunnis tolerated
them as long as the fight was against the US and the Shi’ites, but
when the US stopped trying to defeat Sunni insurgents, they found it
useful to help the US against al qaeda; al qaeda was unpopular anyway.
They also saw that the US meant business when it was telling the
Shi’ite government that it had to share oil revenues with the Sunnis
and bring Sunni militias into the Iraqi military.

The Iraqi government hated these developments. They’d been held down
by the Sunni minority for so long, and it now appeared that the US was
helping the Sunni tribes remain well armed and outside the reach of
Iraq’s central government (most Sunni areas are controlled by Sunni
tribal forces), and were now siding with the Sunnis over fights about
Iraq’s economy and political settlement. There is a lot of corruption
in Iraq, and government officials knew that opening this to the Sunnis
would not only threaten revenue sources, but could open a path for
Sunnis to grab a chunk of power.

What if the Iranians came to the rescue? What if they told Maliki “you
don’t need the Americans, we’ll make sure you have the capacity to
secure the region. We’ll make sure that al Sadr is not a thorn in your
side, and help your government gain control of the Shi’ite regions in
Iraq. The price is that you do not allow the Americans to use Iraq as
a permanent base, and instead you demand they leave relatively
quickly.”

Maliki’s calculation would be simple. The US is disliked by the Iraq
people, the American public is divided by the war, and for the most
part wants the US out of Iraq, and America is pressuring the
government to help their Sunni rivals. Moreover, Americans are
complaining about Iraq oil revenues and budget surpluses. How much
more can the US really do for Maliki? It might even force him out like
it did Jaafari, or weaken him politically by making him look like a
lackey for the West. But Iran is next door, fellow Shi’ites, and
despite the Arab-Persian rivalry, Iran housed and helped most of the
Iraqi parties in government during Saddam’s rule. Iran is their
natural partner. Iran will be there and can provide more than the
Americans can. Most importantly, Iraq knows that despite Iran’s power,
Iraq has partners in the Arab world that can help assure that Iran
cannot dominate Iraq. The US has shown a desire to try to get the
results it wants in Iraq, from election systems, to particular laws
(’benchmarks’) and naming the Prime Minister.

So while McCain and Bush take credit for the ’surge,’ Iraq is quickly
trying to get the US to leave, and appears to have a closer
relationship with ever with Iran, a country which continues to thumb
its nose at the West on nuclear research.

It would all be rather comical, just how much the US spent in order to
lose so much in Iraq. The US lost prestige, is no longer feared, is
finding Afghanistan in disintegration, has massive budget deficits, a
weakened economy, is divided politically, and appears almost a paper
tiger, unable to finish the two wars it started. The irony of ironies
is that even in Iraq, where they are trying to claim some success
(though that’s a dubious argument even if their premise that the surge
worked were true), it may really be that the country’s arch-rival Iran
has benefited most from US policies. Not just Iran, but the hardliners
in Iran have gained the most! Meanwhile, Islamic extremism has been on
the rise, and terrorist groups relatively ignored.

However the deaths are real. There are numerous orphans, widows, and
destroyed families and villages in Iraq, where children will never
have a normal life, having been surrounded by war and violence, and
people will be scared physically and spiritually for decades. There
are American families who have lost loved ones, divorces caused by the
psychological toll of numerous deployments and the horror of war, and
veterans who also will never live a normal life due to what they
experienced. All this because policy makers engaged in hubris,
overestimated the benefits of military power, and underestimated the
heavy price it would cost.
Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
2008-08-18 18:30:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Erb
It would all be rather comical, just how much the US spent in order to
lose so much in Iraq.
Comical?
Post by Scott Erb
The US lost prestige, is no longer feared, is
finding Afghanistan in disintegration, has massive budget deficits, a
weakened economy, is divided politically, and appears almost a paper
tiger, unable to finish the two wars it started.
The above isn't actually true though. The US is seen as willing to
use force, which is the opposite of a "paper tiger". The US economy
seems positioned better than other economies in the world. The US
didn't just start having a budget deficit. Afghanistan has been in
civil war for decades. It will take decades to build a democracy
there. I hope that that time is taken. At the moment, it is the
lawless areas of Pakistan that are allowing the continued
resistance from the Taliban/al Qaeda forces. That needs to be dealt
with.
Post by Scott Erb
The irony of ironies
is that even in Iraq, where they are trying to claim some success
(though that’s a dubious argument even if their premise that the surge
worked were true), it may really be that the country’s arch-rival Iran
has benefited most from US policies. Not just Iran, but the hardliners
in Iran have gained the most! Meanwhile, Islamic extremism has been on
the rise, and terrorist groups relatively ignored.
Without a relationship with Iraq, how are terrorist groups there to
be not ignored? Elsewhere, perhaps you didn't notice but the news
regularly has reports of terrorists being captured or killed by
American and other forces.
Post by Scott Erb
However the deaths are real. There are numerous orphans, widows, and
destroyed families and villages in Iraq, where children will never
have a normal life, having been surrounded by war and violence,
This is hardly a new thing in Iraq. This difficult time is a
transition to be a better time. I think that's about time.
Post by Scott Erb
and
people will be scared physically and spiritually for decades. There
are American families who have lost loved ones, divorces caused by the
psychological toll of numerous deployments and the horror of war, and
veterans who also will never live a normal life due to what they
experienced. All this because policy makers engaged in hubris,
overestimated the benefits of military power, and underestimated the
heavy price it would cost.
It really is like 9/11 didn't happen in your world. If it did, it
"didn't really cause much damage".
--
Well the Ukraine girls really knock me out,
They leave the West behind,
And Moscow girls make me sing and shout,
That Georgia's always on my my my my my my my my my mind.
Scott Erb
2008-08-19 16:31:46 UTC
Permalink
On Aug 18, 2:30 pm, "Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it,
nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')"
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
It would all be rather comical, just how much the US spent in order to
lose so much in Iraq.
Comical?
Post by Scott Erb
The US lost prestige, is no longer feared, is
finding Afghanistan in disintegration, has massive budget deficits, a
weakened economy, is divided politically, and appears almost a paper
tiger, unable to finish the two wars it started.
The above isn't actually true though. The US is seen as willing to
use force, which is the opposite of a "paper tiger".
Actually no. The Iraq syndrome has set in, and people realize it.
That's one reason Russia is so bold.
http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/04/the-iraq-syndrome/
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
The US economy
seems positioned better than other economies in the world. The US
didn't just start having a budget deficit. Afghanistan has been in
civil war for decades. It will take decades to build a democracy
there. I hope that that time is taken. At the moment, it is the
lawless areas of Pakistan that are allowing the continued
resistance from the Taliban/al Qaeda forces. That needs to be dealt
with.
You say "give it more time." Well, the fact is the "war" in Iraq has
not yielded positive results in the region, and has cost the US
immensely. We're no longer the unipolar power:
http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/13/limits-of-american-power/
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
The irony of ironies
is that even in Iraq, where they are trying to claim some success
(though that’s a dubious argument even if their premise that the surge
worked were true), it may really be that the country’s arch-rival Iran
has benefited most from US policies. Not just Iran, but the hardliners
in Iran have gained the most! Meanwhile, Islamic extremism has been on
the rise, and terrorist groups relatively ignored.
Without a relationship with Iraq, how are terrorist groups there to
be not ignored? Elsewhere, perhaps you didn't notice but the news
regularly has reports of terrorists being captured or killed by
American and other forces.
Iraq has always been irrelevant to the war on terror, a distraction,
not a front line. The CIA believes al qaeda is as strong as
pre-9-11. I see no reason to doubt them.
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
However the deaths are real. There are numerous orphans, widows, and
destroyed families and villages in Iraq, where children will never
have a normal life, having been surrounded by war and violence,
This is hardly a new thing in Iraq. This difficult time is a
transition to be a better time. I think that's about time.
We've unleashed massive destruction at an unprecedented scale in
Iraq. You can't just ignore our acts by saying "oh, things have
always been bad there, so anything we do is OK."
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
and
people will be scared physically and spiritually for decades. There
are American families who have lost loved ones, divorces caused by the
psychological toll of numerous deployments and the horror of war, and
veterans who also will never live a normal life due to what they
experienced. All this because policy makers engaged in hubris,
overestimated the benefits of military power, and underestimated the
heavy price it would cost.
It really is like 9/11 didn't happen in your world. If it did, it
"didn't really cause much damage".
I look at it objectively, not emotionally. I also was not surprised
by it (though it wasn't the tactics I expected to be used)
Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
2008-08-19 16:43:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Erb
On Aug 18, 2:30 pm, "Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it,
nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')"
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
It would all be rather comical, just how much the US spent in order to
lose so much in Iraq.
Comical?
Post by Scott Erb
The US lost prestige, is no longer feared, is
finding Afghanistan in disintegration, has massive budget deficits, a
weakened economy, is divided politically, and appears almost a paper
tiger, unable to finish the two wars it started.
The above isn't actually true though. The US is seen as willing to
use force, which is the opposite of a "paper tiger".
Actually no. The Iraq syndrome has set in, and people realize it.
That's one reason Russia is so bold.
That's silly. Even if the US wasn't in Iraq or Afghanistan, it
can't directly fight Russia in Georgia. If Russia's goal is to
annex Georgia, that isn't helped by saying that the US invaded
Iraq.
Post by Scott Erb
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
The US economy
seems positioned better than other economies in the world. The US
didn't just start having a budget deficit. Afghanistan has been in
civil war for decades. It will take decades to build a democracy
there. I hope that that time is taken. At the moment, it is the
lawless areas of Pakistan that are allowing the continued
resistance from the Taliban/al Qaeda forces. That needs to be dealt
with.
You say "give it more time." Well, the fact is the "war" in Iraq has
not yielded positive results in the region, and has cost the US
I think it has done a lot of good things including push Saudi
Arabia to act against its home-grown terrorist element and do some
reforms, although much more is needed. Iraq is going to have to
succeed as a stable democracy before other nearby countries are
literally forced to change their ways.
Post by Scott Erb
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
The irony of ironies
is that even in Iraq, where they are trying to claim some success
(though that’s a dubious argument even if their premise that the surge
worked were true), it may really be that the country’s arch-rival Iran
has benefited most from US policies. Not just Iran, but the hardliners
in Iran have gained the most! Meanwhile, Islamic extremism has been on
the rise, and terrorist groups relatively ignored.
Without a relationship with Iraq, how are terrorist groups there to
be not ignored? Elsewhere, perhaps you didn't notice but the news
regularly has reports of terrorists being captured or killed by
American and other forces.
Iraq has always been irrelevant to the war on terror, a distraction,
not a front line. The CIA believes al qaeda is as strong as
pre-9-11. I see no reason to doubt them.
What is "al Qaeda"? If we can't even define its limits, how can we
know if it is stronger? Why aren't there regular terrorist attacks
in Europe or even in the United States?
Post by Scott Erb
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
However the deaths are real. There are numerous orphans, widows, and
destroyed families and villages in Iraq, where children will never
have a normal life, having been surrounded by war and violence,
This is hardly a new thing in Iraq. This difficult time is a
transition to be a better time. I think that's about time.
We've unleashed massive destruction at an unprecedented scale in
Iraq. You can't just ignore our acts by saying "oh, things have
always been bad there, so anything we do is OK."
What destruction? The US hasn't really been bombing there since
"Mission Accomplished".
Post by Scott Erb
Post by Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
Post by Scott Erb
and
people will be scared physically and spiritually for decades. There
are American families who have lost loved ones, divorces caused by the
psychological toll of numerous deployments and the horror of war, and
veterans who also will never live a normal life due to what they
experienced. All this because policy makers engaged in hubris,
overestimated the benefits of military power, and underestimated the
heavy price it would cost.
It really is like 9/11 didn't happen in your world. If it did, it
"didn't really cause much damage".
I look at it objectively, not emotionally. I also was not surprised
by it (though it wasn't the tactics I expected to be used)
You should hang out with the guy who claimed that 9/11 was a
"Weapon of Mass Distraction". He said that on 9/11, one time. I
don't know who he was, but I remember it. Were you on TV at the
time?
--
Well the Ukraine girls really knock me out,
They leave the West behind,
And Moscow girls make me sing and shout,
That Georgia's always on my my my my my my my my my mind.
Kurt Nicklas
2008-08-19 00:14:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
we are having in Iraq. So now that things are improving you're
desperate
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
that we did.

Oh well, you may be an angry, frustrated little man but at least you
don't teach
in MY state.
morgan mair fheal
2008-08-19 03:01:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
its welcoming alliances with iran
and its planning to sell its oil to china
what are we winning?

arf meow arf - raggedy ann and andy for president and vice
limp and spineless lint for brains is better yet and nice
then rueing pair of shrub and dick the republican lice
call me desdenova seven seven seven seven seven seven
N***@Click.com
2008-08-19 04:39:15 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 20:01:22 -0700, morgan mair fheal
Post by morgan mair fheal
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
His lips fluttering against bush's asshole.......

Careful----Nickkkers is famous for complaints,
late-night crank calls, and rehabing Russian hookers.
Kurt Nicklas
2008-08-19 10:15:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by morgan mair fheal
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
prove it

prove iraq exists

prove you exist

I'm waiting.......
morgan mair fheal
2008-08-19 10:50:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kurt Nicklas
In article
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
prove it
prove iraq exists
prove you exist
why?

arf meow arf - raggedy ann and andy for president and vice
limp and spineless lint for brains is better yet and nice
then rueing pair of shrub and dick the republican lice
call me desdenova seven seven seven seven seven seven
Kurt Nicklas
2008-08-19 11:17:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kurt Nicklas
In article
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
prove it
prove iraq exists
prove you exist
why?
because
N***@Click.com
2008-08-19 14:50:19 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 04:17:45 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Scott Erb
Post by Kurt Nicklas
prove it
prove iraq exists
prove you exist
why?
because
Because he wants a crank, hang-up phone call from you,
Knickkers

But be sober----
N***@Click.com
2008-08-19 14:49:30 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 03:15:27 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
prove it
prove iraq exists
prove you exist
I'm waiting.......
I'm still waiting for you to make one of your drunken
late-night crank calls, KNickkkers
Scott Erb
2008-08-19 16:32:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by morgan mair fheal
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
its welcoming alliances with iran
and its planning to sell its oil to china
what are we winning?
He knows it was a failure, he's just posturing. Otherwise, he'd
actually confront the argument and the issues.
Kurt Nicklas
2008-08-19 22:57:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by morgan mair fheal
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surge/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
its welcoming alliances with iran
and its planning to sell its oil to china
what are we winning?
He knows it was a failure, he's just posturing.  Otherwise, he'd
actually confront the argument and the issues.
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
morgan mair fheal
2008-08-19 23:08:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kurt Nicklas
In article
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surg
e/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
its welcoming alliances with iran
and its planning to sell its oil to china
what are we winning?
He knows it was a failure, he's just posturing.  Otherwise, he'd
actually confront the argument and the issues.
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
as the french phrase goes tu es pleine de merde

arf meow arf - raggedy ann and andy for president and vice
limp and spineless lint for brains is better yet and nice
then rueing pair of shrub and dick the republican lice
call me desdenova seven seven seven seven seven seven
Kurt Nicklas
2008-08-19 23:39:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by morgan mair fheal
Post by Kurt Nicklas
In article
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason
to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surg
e/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
its welcoming alliances with iran
and its planning to sell its oil to china
what are we winning?
He knows it was a failure, he's just posturing.  Otherwise, he'd
actually confront the argument and the issues.
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
as the french phrase goes tu es pleine de merde
Vot amerikanets kotorij ne mozhet pravil'no pisat' ni na angliskom
ni na frantsuzkom.

{snickers}
Gandalf Grey
2008-08-20 00:03:54 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by Kurt Nicklas
In article
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason
to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surg
e/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
its welcoming alliances with iran
and its planning to sell its oil to china
what are we winning?
He knows it was a failure, he's just posturing. Otherwise, he'd
actually confront the argument and the issues.
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
as the french phrase goes tu es pleine de merde
% Vot amerikanets kotorij ne mozhet pravil'no pisat' ni na angliskom
ni na frantsuzkom.


??? ?? ?????????? ?? ????? ??? ??????? ??? ?????????????, Dickless. ????
???? ?? ??????????? ??? ??? ????? ??? ???????.
N***@Click.com
2008-08-20 01:24:46 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 16:39:05 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by morgan mair fheal
as the french phrase goes tu es pleine de merde
Vot amerikanets kotorij ne mozhet pravil'no pisat' ni na angliskom
ni na frantsuzkom.
Translates into: "$20 dollar American for a quickie"

Right Knickkkers?
morgan mair fheal
2008-08-20 04:12:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by N***@Click.com
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 16:39:05 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by morgan mair fheal
as the french phrase goes tu es pleine de merde
Vot amerikanets kotorij ne mozhet pravil'no pisat' ni na angliskom
ni na frantsuzkom.
Translates into: "$20 dollar American for a quickie"
assumes i care what the translation is

arf meow arf - raggedy ann and andy for president and vice
limp and spineless lint for brains is better yet and nice
then rueing pair of shrub and dick the republican lice
call me desdenova seven seven seven seven seven seven
N***@Click.com
2008-08-20 14:18:33 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 21:12:55 -0700, morgan mair fheal
Post by morgan mair fheal
Post by N***@Click.com
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 16:39:05 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by morgan mair fheal
as the french phrase goes tu es pleine de merde
Vot amerikanets kotorij ne mozhet pravil'no pisat' ni na angliskom
ni na frantsuzkom.
Translates into: "$20 dollar American for a quickie"
assumes i care what the translation is
Which assumes whether or not you care is relevant to
anything

Knickkkers does, and at any minute should bury his
shamed head in the sand a little deeper.
Bill Bonde { ''Well, boys, I reckon this is it, nuclear combat toe to toe with the Roosskies'')
2008-08-20 05:52:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by morgan mair fheal
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Scott Erb
In article
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
Looking at how things are going in Iraq, there is strong reason
to
question the narrative that the "surge worked."
No, actually there isn't.
From:http://scotterb.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/credit-iran-not-the-surg
e/
American officials have been stun....
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
what success is that?
Post by Kurt Nicklas
to prove somehow, someway that, although we're winning, it's really
nothing
winning what?
iraq wants no permanent usa bases
its welcoming alliances with iran
and its planning to sell its oil to china
what are we winning?
He knows it was a failure, he's just posturing. Otherwise, he'd
actually confront the argument and the issues.
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
as the french phrase goes tu es pleine de merde
Ya ne govoryu po-frogski.
--
Well the Ukraine girls really knock me out,
They leave the West behind,
And Moscow girls make me sing and shout,
That Georgia's always on my my my my my my my my my mind.
N***@Click.com
2008-08-20 01:23:44 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:57:05 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
Exactly the phrase your roosian wife used in the
underground subway?
pyjamarama
2008-08-20 14:21:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by N***@Click.com
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:57:05 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
Exactly the phrase your roosian wife used in the
underground subway?
Some putrid phrases Gary Roselles used in a mine shaft <snicker>

Citing Gary Roselles for his sickening racial/homophobic slurs,
threats, calls to murder and complete lack of Usenet Intellect (all of
which his buddy Hank is in COMPLETE agreement with...):

(See links to originals at):

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater/msg/943bd273a8bd0290?hl=en

On 23 Aug 2006 04:29:00 -0700, Gary Roselles <***@KNICKLAS.COM>
wrote: "What the fuck would a dumb cocksucker like (distinguished
black scholar) Sowell, who sits out at Stanford,never having worked a
day in his Uncle Tom life, know anything?"

On Jun 6, 09:33:41, ***@Knicklas.com wrote of distinguished African-
American scholars Thomas Sowell and Walter Williams: "Both are
traitors to their race

On May 6, 7:18 am, Gary Roselles <***@Click.com> wrote:"Group
Negro Poster Pyjamarma admits to being a coon, coconut headed hater"

On Apr 30, 2:40 pm, Gary Roselles <***@Click.com> wrote: "Those
who stand up for their race, their issues, their causes are those you
hate."

On 18 Feb 2007 09:45:03 GMT Gary Roselles <***@Knicklas.com>wrote:
"Then why was you mother stupid enough to fuck all them black guys?"

On 30 Oct 2006 11:13:21 -0800, Gary Roselles <***@Knicklas.com>wrote:
"brown niggers need to be taken out"

On 24 Apr 2001 17:43:01 GMT Gary Roselles <***@idt.net> wrote (in
reply to an Op-Ed by African-American Rev. Jesse Lee Peterson):
'Say"yes Massa", Uncle Tom.'

On Thu, 28 Dec 2000 19:27:54 GMT, Gary Roselles
<***@idt.net>wrote: You actually think that placing blackskinned,
white thinking people is going to gain anything with real minorities?

On Thu, 28 Dec 2000 19:27:54 GMT, Gary Roselles
<***@idt.net>wrote: "Bush's Uncle tom Cabinet is good first step
for GOP"

"His appointment will bridge nothing. It's apparant he's being an
uncle tom to appease voters." Gary Roselles on Gen. Colin Powell Dec
18 2000

"May a real american have the honor of putting a bullet between her
eyes." -- Gary Roselles on what he'd like to do Rob Robertson's
teenage daughter. 11/14/2000

"Hilliary has more intellect and balls than you do, you racist
faggot." -- Homophobe Gary Roselles with another of his patented slurs
May 8 2007

"Yeah, there's a real fucking credible authority----Hitchens a faggot
socialist" -- Homophobe Gary Roselles, Apr 20 2006

"The word Faggot just describes a gay person" -- Homophobe Gary
Roselles Mar 7 2001

"She should be at least shot" -- Gary Roselles on killing Katherine
Harris Dec 1st 2001

"I call Kathering Harris a nazi/fascist right wing ideologue whore.
What did we do to German nazis right wing whores?" -- Gary Roselles,
Jan 8 2001

Hating RIGHT WINGERS is doing God's work, Dumbapropyl -- Gary
Roselles, Jan 8 2001

"I consider hating RIGHT WING nazi/fascist fucks like you a God
inspired emotion." Gary Roselles, Jan 8 2001
N***@Click.com
2008-08-20 20:16:30 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 07:21:12 -0700 (PDT), pyjamarama
Post by pyjamarama
Post by N***@Click.com
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:57:05 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
Exactly the phrase your roosian wife used in the
underground subway?
Some putrid phrases Gary Roselles used in a mine shaft <snicker>
=============================================================================================
Post by N***@Click.com
On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 09:08:15 -0700 (PDT), pyjamarama
Its still a free country...and if someone doesnt want to hire a nigger
like yourself forinstance...because they dont want a smelly lazy stealing stupid semi
human working for them....more power to em.
Now..if you have a federal contract...then you MUST have 10 percent
minorites working for you...
THAT is why there are so many niggas employed in Washington DC in the
Goverment.
Otherwise...we could use trained monkeys to do the same and save some
bucks.
love ya
hank
pyjamarama
2008-08-20 22:26:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by N***@Click.com
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 07:21:12 -0700 (PDT), pyjamarama
Post by pyjamarama
Post by N***@Click.com
On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 15:57:05 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
As the Russian phrase goes, "Idi na khuj".
Exactly the phrase your roosian wife used in the
underground subway?
Some putrid phrases Gary Roselles used in a mine shaft <snicker>
==========================================================================­===================
Post by N***@Click.com
On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 09:08:15 -0700 (PDT), pyjamarama
Its still a free country...and if someone doesnt want to hire a nigger
like yourself forinstance...because they dont want a smelly lazy stealing stupid semi
human working for them....more power to em.
Now..if you have a federal contract...then you MUST have 10 percent
minorites working for you...
THAT is why there are so many niggas employed in Washington DC in the
Goverment.
Otherwise...we could use trained monkeys to do the same and save some
bucks.
love ya
hank- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Roselles' buddy Hank on blacks:

"THAT is why there are so many niggas employed in Washington DC in the
Goverment."

Roselles himself on blacks:

"brown niggers need to be taken out"

and

"Say YES MASSA, Uncle Tom"

and

"Then why was you mother stupid enough to fuck all them black guys?"

See any difference?
_________________________________________________________________

Citing Gary Roselles for his sickening racial/homophobic slurs,
threats, calls to murder and complete lack of Usenet Intellect (all of
which his buddy Hank is in COMPLETE agreement with...):

(See links to originals at):

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater/msg/943bd273a8bd0290?hl=en

On 23 Aug 2006 04:29:00 -0700, Gary Roselles <***@KNICKLAS.COM>
wrote: "What the fuck would a dumb cocksucker like (distinguished
black scholar) Sowell, who sits out at Stanford,never having worked a
day in his Uncle Tom life, know anything?"

On Jun 6, 09:33:41, ***@Knicklas.com wrote of distinguished African-
American scholars Thomas Sowell and Walter Williams: "Both are
traitors to their race

On May 6, 7:18 am, Gary Roselles <***@Click.com> wrote:"Group
Negro Poster Pyjamarma admits to being a coon, coconut headed hater"

On Apr 30, 2:40 pm, Gary Roselles <***@Click.com> wrote: "Those
who stand up for their race, their issues, their causes are those you
hate."

On 18 Feb 2007 09:45:03 GMT Gary Roselles <***@Knicklas.com>wrote:
"Then why was you mother stupid enough to fuck all them black guys?"

On 30 Oct 2006 11:13:21 -0800, Gary Roselles <***@Knicklas.com>wrote:
"brown niggers need to be taken out"

On 24 Apr 2001 17:43:01 GMT Gary Roselles <***@idt.net> wrote (in
reply to an Op-Ed by African-American Rev. Jesse Lee Peterson):
'Say"yes Massa", Uncle Tom.'

On Thu, 28 Dec 2000 19:27:54 GMT, Gary Roselles
<***@idt.net>wrote: You actually think that placing blackskinned,
white thinking people is going to gain anything with real minorities?

On Thu, 28 Dec 2000 19:27:54 GMT, Gary Roselles
<***@idt.net>wrote: "Bush's Uncle tom Cabinet is good first step
for GOP"

"His appointment will bridge nothing. It's apparant he's being an
uncle tom to appease voters." Gary Roselles on Gen. Colin Powell Dec
18 2000

"May a real american have the honor of putting a bullet between her
eyes." -- Gary Roselles on what he'd like to do Rob Robertson's
teenage daughter. 11/14/2000

"Hilliary has more intellect and balls than you do, you racist
faggot." -- Homophobe Gary Roselles with another of his patented slurs
May 8 2007

"Yeah, there's a real fucking credible authority----Hitchens a faggot
socialist" -- Homophobe Gary Roselles, Apr 20 2006

"The word Faggot just describes a gay person" -- Homophobe Gary
Roselles Mar 7 2001

"She should be at least shot" -- Gary Roselles on killing Katherine
Harris Dec 1st 2001

"I call Kathering Harris a nazi/fascist right wing ideologue whore.
What did we do to German nazis right wing whores?" -- Gary Roselles,
Jan 8 2001

Hating RIGHT WINGERS is doing God's work, Dumbapropyl -- Gary
Roselles, Jan 8 2001

"I consider hating RIGHT WING nazi/fascist fucks like you a God
inspired emotion." Gary Roselles, Jan 8 2001
N***@Click.com
2008-08-20 22:53:09 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 15:26:11 -0700 (PDT), pyjamarama
Um, Poopy

In response to my calling YOU on your racist views and
NON-HIRING Blacks, Here's Hank Defending YOU

SNICKER
Post by pyjamarama
=============================================================================================
Post by N***@Click.com
On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 09:08:15 -0700 (PDT), pyjamarama
Its still a free country...and if someone doesnt want to hire a nigger
like yourself forinstance...because they dont want a smelly lazy stealing stupid semi
human working for them....more power to em.
Now..if you have a federal contract...then you MUST have 10 percent
minorites working for you...
THAT is why there are so many niggas employed in Washington DC in the
Goverment.
Otherwise...we could use trained monkeys to do the same and save some
bucks.
love ya
hank
pyjamarama
2008-08-20 23:17:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by N***@Click.com
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 15:26:11 -0700 (PDT), pyjamarama
Um, Poopy
In response to my calling YOU on your racist views and
NON-HIRING Blacks
So you can cite these "racist views" and this "NON-HIRING (of)
Blacks?"

Hmmmm??

Then by all means do so.

<SNICKER>

Roselles' buddy Hank on blacks:

"THAT is why there are so many niggas employed in Washington DC in the
Goverment."

Roselles himself on blacks:

"brown niggers need to be taken out"

and

"Say YES MASSA, Uncle Tom"

and

"Then why was you mother stupid enough to fuck all them black guys?"

See any difference?

N***@Click.com
2008-08-19 04:37:56 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:14:20 -0700 (PDT), Kurt Nicklas
Post by Kurt Nicklas
I'm "stun" by the verbal lengths you'll go to try to rationalize the
success
we are having in Iraq
So---only 4200 dead is a success?

Were you expecting more?
Loading...